ADRIFT Forum


The place to discuss the ADRIFT Interactive Fiction toolkit

ADRIFT 5 source code

This forum is the place to learn about and discuss ADRIFT 5. Feel free to mention any bugs you find here, but please also add these to the Bugs & Enhancements list.

Please also refer to the ADRIFT 5 Wiki for more information.

ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby BBBen » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:28 am

I take it that the source code for ADRIFT 5 is still privately held by Campbell. Just wondering, has he ever considered releasing it? And what's it built in? I ask despite not knowing anything about coding myself, of course. It's maybe possible I could get a programmer involved to make certain changes I'd like to see to the system that are unlikely to happen in future versions.
BBBen
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:46 am

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby BBBen » Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:38 am

A quick list of changes I'd like to see made (these are changes I'd be willing to pay a fair amount to have implemented, by the way):
- A fix so executables don't trigger virus scanners any more, or some workaround that doesn't require the install of the runner software separately.
- A fix to the need to have English language settings and decimal point separators.
- Greater ability to set how the runner frames are laid out - so I can reliably predict how the game will look on other systems.
- Buttons, like in ADRIFT 4 but a) more customisable so I can decide what they say, what they do, how they look, whether they just have a picture on them, etc. and b) they can embed in the frame so I don't need two windows.
- A more editable UI overall; I'd like to be able to set the layout more substantially and fix it in place, lay in images to set the frame, etc.
- .png file implementation so I can layer images. It would be cool, for example, to be able to have a png pop up over the whole window and then go away with a click.
- A fix for the bugs and crashes people get when using the map to move.
- Optionally removable command line, so if I want to I can make the game entirely point-and-click with the buttons. Why would I not just move to a visual system then? Because there's still benefits to the text based format even without the command line.
- Enable or disable elements like the ability to click on words for a list of options (they might not fit my preferred command structure). Also, editing the presented menu options when you do click words would be nice.
- The ability to set background images behind maps - actually, while we're at it, I'd like to be able to have the map display in a more discrete way. At the moment it's too big and I don't always want the 3D map display angles, either.

Right now I can do a lot with the system but I can't make it look any more professional, nor can I solve certain accessibility problems. Some of these problems are relatively small, others are major changes, I know, but I would go a long way to make them happen.
BBBen
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:46 am

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby Po. Prune » Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:51 am

BBBen wrote:I take it that the source code for ADRIFT 5 is still privately held by Campbell. Just wondering, has he ever considered releasing it? And what's it built in? I ask despite not knowing anything about coding myself, of course. It's maybe possible I could get a programmer involved to make certain changes I'd like to see to the system that are unlikely to happen in future versions.


At some point Campbell mentioned the possibility of making V.5 open source. I talked to him not that long ago and he mentioned that he was still considering the possibility. But whether it's going to happen or not I have no clue.
I can't blame him for being reluctant, though. It must be something like putting your only child up for adoption... :(
D-Day V.5 in progress 79Kb so far (slowly getting there)
Anno 1700 in progress 111Kb
User avatar
Po. Prune
Moderator
 
Posts: 3938
Joined: Mon Jun 24, 2002 8:18 am
Location: Denmark

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby BBBen » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:03 am

Po. Prune wrote:
BBBen wrote:I take it that the source code for ADRIFT 5 is still privately held by Campbell. Just wondering, has he ever considered releasing it? And what's it built in? I ask despite not knowing anything about coding myself, of course. It's maybe possible I could get a programmer involved to make certain changes I'd like to see to the system that are unlikely to happen in future versions.


At some point Campbell mentioned the possibility of making V.5 open source. I talked to him not that long ago and he mentioned that he was still considering the possibility. But whether it's going to happen or not I have no clue.
I can't blame him for being reluctant, though. It must be something like putting your only child up for adoption... :(

Yeah, but it could make a big difference. Or hell, I'd be willing to pay him to implement the kind of stuff I want in the system, I don't need it to be open source.
BBBen
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:46 am

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby saabie » Fri Feb 17, 2017 12:45 pm

I think I can remember Campbell once mentioning that ADRIFT was written in VB.net, it is certainly using the .net library as the only DLL it links to is mscoree.dll
I am a programmer and I already understand most of how ADRIFT works internally so I would be able to do the programming work if Campbell is too busy.

The problem with the false antivirus detections with the EXE format seems to be caused by the fact that the ADRIFT 5 XML is stored as a ZIP file inside of the EXE. To fix this you would have to change the format that the data is stored in. Storing the actual data as records (without all of the extra XML stuff the developer uses but the runner doesnt need) would stop these detections, probably make the file smaller, and would certainly make it run faster.

The question about open-sourcing or merging the runner into gargoyle has been coming up every few years since at least 2009, but even if Cambell does not choose to do so it would still be possible to write a new runner that emulates the behavior of the existing code.
saabie
 
Posts: 830
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 2:07 am
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby Po. Prune » Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:36 pm

BBBen wrote:Yeah, but it could make a big difference. Or hell, I'd be willing to pay him to implement the kind of stuff I want in the system, I don't need it to be open source.

Well, there's nothing stopping you from donating some money :wink:
There's a donate button at the Adrift webpage, unfortunately not very many uses it.
D-Day V.5 in progress 79Kb so far (slowly getting there)
Anno 1700 in progress 111Kb
User avatar
Po. Prune
Moderator
 
Posts: 3938
Joined: Mon Jun 24, 2002 8:18 am
Location: Denmark

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby Lazzah » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:34 pm

Po. Prune wrote:
BBBen wrote:Yeah, but it could make a big difference. Or hell, I'd be willing to pay him to implement the kind of stuff I want in the system, I don't need it to be open source.

Well, there's nothing stopping you from donating some money :wink:
There's a donate button at the Adrift webpage, unfortunately not very many uses it.

Even if we did donate money, would Campbell have the time to implement these much needed features into ADRIFT? Let's be honest about this, he has devoted very little of his time to ADRIFT over the past couple of years and on the rare occasions that he has released upgrades there have been often serious bugs in them because he has taken his eye off the ball for so long. I appreciate that he now has a family to look after, etc, etc, but he has created this utility we all use and we as users are totally dependant on him for upgrades. It is getting on for 8 months since the last upgrade and the interval between them seems to be getting longer each time.

I for one would be willing to donate a small but regular amount towards the development of ADRIFT, but only if we could be guaranteed that it would happen.
OUT NOW: The Lost Children
Current W.I.P.: Magnetic Moon
Also available: The Axe of Kolt, The Spectre of Castle Coris, The Fortress of Fear, Die Feuerfaust - The Fist of Fire
User avatar
Lazzah
Moderator
 
Posts: 2014
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2011 4:54 am
Location: London, England

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby David Whyld » Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:42 pm

I think ADRIFT going open source is long overdue. Clearly Campbell hasn't got the time, or the inclination, to devote to it the way he did years ago and it's definitely suffering as a result. If it went open source, people with the required coding skills - and I know there are a few here - could develop it how they saw fit.
David Whyld
 
Posts: 6535
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2004 5:15 pm
Location: United Kingdom

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby BBBen » Fri Feb 17, 2017 11:34 pm

Po. Prune wrote:
BBBen wrote:Yeah, but it could make a big difference. Or hell, I'd be willing to pay him to implement the kind of stuff I want in the system, I don't need it to be open source.

Well, there's nothing stopping you from donating some money :wink:
There's a donate button at the Adrift webpage, unfortunately not very many uses it.

I'd be happy to donate a little regularly if he were working on it regularly, but that's not what I was talking about. I meant I would be willing to actually pay for his time (or someone else if it were open source) to specifically implement the features I need. It'd be an investment for me if I could make the platform more powerful, more professional-looking and more accessible. It would save me a lot of time and trouble coming up with an alternative in a different engine that wouldn't have the option of keeping ADRIFT's command line.
BBBen
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:46 am

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby ralphmerridew » Sat Feb 18, 2017 7:47 pm

As far as adding features / bugfixes goes, letting additional programmers into the ADRIFT project would probably help. But open-sourcing it wouldn't be much more of a benefit.

ADRIFT is designed in a manner that most of the smarts are in Runner.

Adding new features for your game would generally end up either:
a) getting those changes into the official Runner (and would have to be done in a way that wouldn't change how any existing game runs).
or b) releasing a special Runner just for your game (which fragments Runner).

saabie, how much programming experience do you have (what languages, not necessarily IF related)? To what extent is your experience just writing programs within an existing language, and to what extent do you have experience creating languages?
Bloodhounds can make you laugh and cuss in the same breath. They are endearing, faithful, and can sling drool ten feet in any direction. -- Virginia Lanier
User avatar
ralphmerridew
 
Posts: 2496
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2002 11:56 pm
Location: Missouri

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby saabie » Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:39 pm

ralphmerridew, Most of my experience is with Delphi and Free-Pascal which I have been using for decades.
This includes user interfaces for non-technical office staff and production line workers, low-level hardware control of test equipment, and OpenGL graphics.

I have used visual basic for database queries and presentation.

Other languages I have used (mostly a long time ago) include CDC basic, Cobol, RPG, C, C++, Fortran, x86 assembler, Z80 assembler, 6502 assembler and various microcontroller assembers.
As for creating a language, I have designed a programming language that takes the best bits of languages I like and I am currently writing a compiler for it.
Last edited by saabie on Sun Feb 19, 2017 1:14 am, edited 2 times in total.
saabie
 
Posts: 830
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 2:07 am
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby BBBen » Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:42 pm

Personally, I don't think fragmenting the runner is inherently a terrible problem, if the only games that use the specialised version of it are released specifically with that runner. I mean, I could picture this approach working just fine if the game were packaged with a blorb and a standalone playable runner that automatically accessed the blorb in the folder.

That said, without any programming experience, I figure you could have a runner that could simply default to basic settings unless other features are enabled.
BBBen
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:46 am

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby ralphmerridew » Sun Feb 19, 2017 12:43 am

Well, if you want, I'll send you what I've worked out on ADRIFT 5. (Not much, just readers for .tas and .taf.)
Bloodhounds can make you laugh and cuss in the same breath. They are endearing, faithful, and can sling drool ten feet in any direction. -- Virginia Lanier
User avatar
ralphmerridew
 
Posts: 2496
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2002 11:56 pm
Location: Missouri

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby BBBen » Sun Feb 19, 2017 1:07 am

Sure, I'll check it out
BBBen
 
Posts: 279
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:46 am

Re: ADRIFT 5 source code

Postby ralphmerridew » Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:28 am

Sorry, that was meant for saabie. What I have would only be meaningful to a coder.
Bloodhounds can make you laugh and cuss in the same breath. They are endearing, faithful, and can sling drool ten feet in any direction. -- Virginia Lanier
User avatar
ralphmerridew
 
Posts: 2496
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2002 11:56 pm
Location: Missouri

Next

Return to ADRIFT 5.0

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests