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Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

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Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Stephen49 » Sat Nov 01, 2014 8:00 pm

One of the things I've found interesting in Adrift 5 is that there is no native support for commands like "Enter Cave", "Follow Road", or even "Exit" All of these exist in most IF language implemtations, dating all the way back to the original FORTRAN "Colossal Cave Adventure." They can be implemented in Adrift, but its not trivial. Let's take Follow Road...

Creating a "Follow %object%" General command was easy enough
Ditto for creating a "road" scenery object
And since the road exists in three locations I also created a Road Group to put the road object in all three places

And this is where I first ran into trouble. The problem is that the destination the "follow road" command takes me to needs to depend on my location when I enter it. I couldn't find this within the syntax of the command or the object.

What would have solved this is a way for a failure of a restriction to launch another task rather than abort with a message. That would allow me to chain tasks with the first one that passes its restrictions executing, or if none pass, exiting with the failure message in the final task

After looking at various options for tasks and events decided it would be simpler just to create a unique road obeect for each location. Which got me to the next observation...

When creating multiple objects with the same name there is no way (I can find) to tell them apart in the Objects List. They all show up as "a narrow dirt road"

So I found a solution that works and I'm moving on. But if anybody has a idea for a cleaner, simpler implementation I'd appreciate it.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Campbell » Sat Nov 01, 2014 11:55 pm

I guess the lack of implementation is either because I haven't spotted they were missing, or I haven't come across the command before (as in follow). What happens if the road leads North and South and you type "follow road"? Would you expect to be prompted? Would you expect also to be able to type "follow road north"?
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby saabie » Sun Nov 02, 2014 12:04 am

Stephen49 wrote:One of the things I've found interesting in Adrift 5 is that there is no native support for commands like "Enter Cave", "Follow Road", or even "Exit".
If you click on the word "Out" on the direction page of a location then it opens a window that shows the words that can be used to go OUT.
You can add "/Enter" to this (so it now says "Out/O/Outside/Exit") and the player can now type "Exit" to move Out.

Stephen49 wrote:The problem is that the destination the "follow road" command takes me to needs to depend on my location when I enter it. I couldn't find this within the syntax of the command or the object.
Then you need a specific task for each location.
Right-click on the "follow %object%" general task in the folder and select "add specific task"
Click on object and choose the road object.
Tick "Task is repeatable" at the bottom of the page.
Add the message you want displayed when the player follows the road.
Create a restriction that [The player character] must be at this specific location, but DONT put any text at all in its message box.
Create an action to move the player character to the new location.

The other two specific tasks are the same except the restriction and action are for a different location.

Stephen49 wrote:What would have solved this is a way for a failure of a restriction to launch another task rather than abort with a message. That would allow me to chain tasks with the first one that passes its restrictions executing, or if none pass, exiting with the failure message in the final task.
Easy, just leave the text box of the restriction completely blank and ADRIFT will continue on to the next task (in priority order).
If all of the (override) specific tasks fail without printing a message, then ADRIFT will go back to the general task and print its message.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Stephen49 » Sun Nov 02, 2014 1:02 am

Thanks for the tip on the direction page. For the "which way do you go if the road goes both ways" question, I can't rhink of a good solution. For my particular case the player starts at the end of the road so "follow" always goes the way the player didn't enter from.

I would like to see the ability to branch to a different task from a failed restriction though. I'll get an enhancement request in on it.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Po. Prune » Sun Nov 02, 2014 8:24 am

Stephen49 wrote:Thanks for the tip on the direction page. For the "which way do you go if the road goes both ways" question, I can't rhink of a good solution. For my particular case the player starts at the end of the road so "follow" always goes the way the player didn't enter from.

I would like to see the ability to branch to a different task from a failed restriction though. I'll get an enhancement request in on it.


In case your player starts at the end of a road (say leading North)
You could always make a task (repetative) with the command "follow road" and then move the player North. That would take care of that problem. Although in my opinion it's very seldom that anyone would use the command "follow road" unless it's specifically mentioned as an option in the text.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Lazzah » Sun Nov 02, 2014 9:06 am

Po. Prune wrote:Although in my opinion it's very seldom that anyone would use the command "follow road" unless it's specifically mentioned as an option in the text.

I agree with Po. Prune. A player is more likely to follow a track or a trail they have just found, especially if there are no exits shown where the track/trail goes to. If there is a road where you list the exits from any of the locations any player will go for the easy option of typing in a direction rather than having to type in FOLLOW ROAD.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby ralphmerridew » Sun Nov 02, 2014 3:58 pm

In response to "FOLLOW ROAD" when the road goes in two directions, I would accept "The road's not moving." or the like as sufficient. (Like Po Prune and Lazzah said, I'm personally not likely to enter "FOLLOW ROAD" when compass directions are available.)

But if you want it to move the player:
If the player's previous room was one of the two road rooms, interpret the command as moving towards the other. If the player's previous room was anywhere else, give a response like "The road goes ___ and ___."

Sample Transcript wrote:South End of Road
A road goes north.
> FOLLOW ROAD
You head north.
Middle of the Road
The road extends south and northeast. Forest surrounds you on other sides.
> FOLLOW ROAD
You head northeast.
North End of Road
The road goes southwest.
> SW
Middle of the Road
> WEST
Forest
> EAST
Middle of the Road
> FOLLOW ROAD
Which way? The road goes northeast and south.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Lumin » Wed Nov 19, 2014 4:18 pm

I've never encountered a 'follow road' command in any game, and actually this thread is the first I've heard of it. And I can't think of any situation where, as a player, I'd want to type out 'follow road north' or whatever instead of just 'n'.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby R2T1 » Wed Nov 19, 2014 10:10 pm

Actually there was a type-in game back in the 70s that used FOLLOW - One was FOLLOW MAP & then FOLLOW ROAD. The game was called 'Lost Dutchman's Mine' and I think it was published in BYTE magazine or Creative Computing. It was written in BASIC. I still have my copy somewhere. I rewrote it in Inform 6 following a series of articles in a UK mag (PC PLUS ? I think) I know that even after typing it in, I still stumbled over FOLLOW when I played it. On reflection it does seem logical now although in this game, it was used as a means to move on into a new area of the world.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Campbell » Wed Nov 19, 2014 11:02 pm

I suppose it's a bit more obvious if the road is yellow. And made from brick.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Lumin » Thu Nov 20, 2014 1:51 am

^^^No lie, I would play the heck out of a Wizard of Oz game.

And it's not a 'follow road' command, but I've been experimenting around with implementing Skyrim-esque 'fast travel' in my big WIP...right now just a 'go' command that can be used at signposts, though it might be based on carriages later.

...I'm not surewhy I brought that up, I just like excuses to talk about my big dumb broken game that will never be finished I guess. v :) v

Reistically though I can't think of many situations where'd you'd want a player to skip over several rooms, it'd have to be a huge game with lots of useless scenery locations to make any kind of sense.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Lazzah » Thu Nov 20, 2014 2:48 pm

Lumin wrote:Realistically though I can't think of many situations where'd you'd want a player to skip over several rooms, it'd have to be a huge game with lots of useless scenery locations to make any kind of sense.

Well, my playtester recently said to me that she wished there was a GOTO command in ADRIFT as I think she was getting a bit fed up traipsing up and down the map (which isn't THAT big!) trying to solve my W.I.P. "The Spectre of Castle Coris". There IS a way you can quickly travel between locations by clicking on a location on the map if it is displayed when you are playing, but I think she prefers playing without it.

I remember back in the good old days of PAW games on the Sinclair Spectrum, I played a few HUGE games with massive maps 20 or 30 locations square, and it took forever going from, e.g., the SW corner to the NW corner. So I loaded the database into PAW and created my own GOTO commands which would take me instantly from a location on one side of the map to the other - it saved SO much time and typing!

I wonder if a GOTO command could be implemented in ADRIFT? Campbell?? :whistle:
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Campbell » Thu Nov 20, 2014 3:18 pm

Lazzah wrote:I wonder if a GOTO command could be implemented in ADRIFT? Campbell?? :whistle:
Yes, I do intend adding that as an option. The code is all pretty much there to do it, I just need to add an option.
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby ralphmerridew » Thu Nov 20, 2014 3:46 pm

I remember Zork I had a number of shortcuts you unlocked throughout the game. Planetfall did as well.

(I think that ADRIFT 4 had a GOTO feature, but it's been removed.)
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Re: Enter, Exit, Leave, Follow

Postby Lumin » Thu Nov 20, 2014 3:57 pm

Sounds like it's mostly an artifact of the ginormous old games of yesteryear then. With modern IF you rarely even need a map, let alone a shortcut.
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